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Got to use the NEX-7 and Zeiss 24mm today ... cancelled my pre-orders.

Discussion in 'Sony Alpha E-Mount Cameras' started by JJJPhoto, Oct 25, 2011.

  1. JJJPhoto

    JJJPhoto TalkEmount Regular

    116
    Aug 8, 2011
    If you pre-ordered the NEX-7 kit and Zeiss 24mm from Amazon you are now one position higher in the pre-order list. I just cancelled my pre-orders after getting to use the Nex-7 kit and 24mm lens today. I work with someone who is reviewing that combo for a website and I got to use the NEX-7 and 24mm lens for a few hours.

    The NEX-7 is a beautiful camera that feels great in my hands and the Zeiss looks great on the outside, but after shooting a few dozen photos and trying the 24mm lens on both the NEX-7 and my NEX-3 I've lost interest.

    It might be my own fault for expecting too much, but I honestly expected the NEX-7 to "blow away" my E-P3 and NEX-3 and the Zeiss to perform even better than the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7 lens. In my humble opinion, they don't.

    I like the quieter shutter, the AWESOME new EVF, the tri-navi controls, the ability to use a REAL flash, and the 10fps burst mode, but I just wasn't "wowed" by the camera or the results. The Zeiss was more disappointing to me because it's a $1,000 lens that (IMHO) doesn't perform as well as lenses that are priced at $600 or less (both the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7 or Panasnic Leica 25mm f/1.4 lenses are cheaper and sharper).

    The NEX-7 image files ABSOLUTELY have better dynamic range than my m4/3 cameras(E-P3, E-PL1 and E-PL1s), but I didn't feel like the 24-megapixel images from the NEX-7 looked better or "obviously" more detailed than the 14-megapixel images from my NEX-3.

    I'm still keeping my pre-order for the 50mm f/1.8 OSS and I "might" decide to order the NEX-7 later after the price drops (maybe when the NEX-8 is announced), but I'm definitely going to pass on the Zeiss 24mm and I've decided that the NEX-7 doesn't live up to the hype enough for me to buy it at full MSRP at the time of launch.

    I'll try to upload some images from my NEX-3 and the Zeiss 24mm tonight and if anyone has specific questions about the NEX-7 or Zeiss 24mm let me know and I'll try to answer them. I still think the NEX-7 is a great camera, it just didn't live up to the hype I had created in my head.
     
  2. adanac

    adanac TalkEmount Regular

    51
    Sep 30, 2011
    Thanks for the feedback.

    I'm glad to know that the dynamic range is better but I wonder if it is better or as good as than the X100 or NEX-5N. I've become used to what the X100 can do with a scene and what I can get out of it during post processing. My hope is that the NEX-7 can at least match that. If so, I won't be unhappy with buying one.

    As for the E ZA 24mm, I'm passing on it as well, sight unseen. I left my pre-order standing for the NEX-7 but dropped the order for the Zeiss 24mm. I'm going to use manual focus Zeiss and other glass instead to augment the kit 18-55mm zoom that I decided to get for general purpose and video use. At the time of order I took advantage of a $100 off coupon on my purchase so the package wasn't a heck of a lot more than my X100.

    I'm actually ok if the 7's images don't look obviously more detailed or better than the 5N can produce. I'd just like to see output in the same class as the 5N or X100 although I would certainly like to know for certain that the 7 can take full advantage of very good manual focus glass. In that regard I'm still wondering!
     
  3. olli

    olli TalkEmount Veteran

    318
    Aug 16, 2011
    Washington DC
    olli
    Not that I was planning to get a NEX-7 but having had the chance to play with a A77 recently if I had the cash for one or the other I would go for the latter. It's a superb camera and even if the NEX-7 lived up to the hype I would still prefer the A77. Unfortunately since I can't afford either I'm not going to have to make the choice:)
     
  4. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    If the IQ is "as good" as on the NEX-5N, which I suppose it is, it's worth the money in my opinion. You get the awesome EVF, the better handling with bigger body and tri-navi-controls as well as the option to use all flashes. This features are worth quite a bit money, although you may be right, it should be priced at around 900 - 1000 body only. Well, the 24 MP sensor probably wouldn't allow that ... after all, there are 24 MP on it.

    But I'm also in the camp "I can't afford it anyways", so I'll stuck with my great NEX-5 and get the best out of it with the 50mm 1.8.
     
  5. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Aug 6, 2011
    Thanks for sharing your impressions! I'm very surprised by the lukewarm reactions I'm seeing to the Zeiss lens. Looking forward to trying one out for myself!
     
  6. JJJPhoto

    JJJPhoto TalkEmount Regular

    116
    Aug 8, 2011
    OK. Here are some sample images I took today with my NEX-3 and the Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 lens (production level lens, in consumer packaging with accessories and paperwork, so I assume this lens will start shipping soon). I'm not posting images from the NEX-7 at this point because I didn't get as much time with it today compared to the 24mm lens. I will try to get some more time and post photos taken with the NEX-7.

    Most of these images were shot at f/1.8 on my NEX-3 (JPEGs straight out of the camera except vertical images were saved as vertical in CS5 before I uploaded them). I confess that I am probably being "harsh" in my judgement of the Zeiss 24mm ... but I'm just not sure it's worth the $1,000 price tag. I've bought and still own many different lenses from old legacy lenses that cost less than $40 to pro-grade telephoto zoom lenses that cost more than $2,000. I don't hesitate to spend a great deal of money on a single lens if I think it's worth it ... but I'm not personally sure the Zeiss is worth it FOR ME.

    Again, the lens is NOT horrible ... it's actually the best NEX lens I've used to date ... but that's not saying much.

    If you aren't a multi-system user like me (someone who also has other cameras and lenses) then you might want to go ahead and buy the Zeiss. I just can't justify spending $1,000 on a lens that doesn't perform as well (to my eyes) as cheaper lenses that I already own ... even if those lenses aren't for the NEX.

    i-mP55wDF-L.

    Full size image:
    http://cincyjacksonfam.smugmug.com/photos/i-mP55wDF/0/O/i-mP55wDF.jpg

    i-9sr75t3-L.

    Full size image:
    http://cincyjacksonfam.smugmug.com/photos/i-9sr75t3/0/O/i-9sr75t3.jpg

    i-C9KBbv5-L.

    Full size image:
    http://cincyjacksonfam.smugmug.com/photos/i-C9KBbv5/0/O/i-C9KBbv5.jpg

    i-JDF9fDt-L.

    Full size image:
    http://cincyjacksonfam.smugmug.com/photos/i-JDF9fDt/0/O/i-JDF9fDt.jpg
     
  7. serhan

    serhan TalkEmount All-Pro

    Aug 27, 2011
    NYC
    I guess it is similar to Zeiss Sonnar 50mm lens, wide open is good for portraits. My wife thinks they look very nice on screen. I am in the same boat as you with m43 and nex...
     
  8. C Wadsworth

    C Wadsworth TalkEmount Regular

    33
    Aug 31, 2011
    A few comments:

    First off, I am not defending this lens or criticizing the shooter. At all!!!

    What I do see is:

    Photo #1 - Motion blur at 1/40 and nothing apparently in focus.
    Photo #2 - Focus is slightly off - looks to be behind the eyes. Still, I would have expected to see more resolution in the hair. The DOF at 1.8 looks to be very shallow at this subject distance.
    Photo #3 - Focus is considerably off - looks to be behind the rose, see the green leaf on the bud behind the flower.
    Photo #4 - Focus is slightly off - looks to be in front of eyes - see text on pacifier.

    So the question I have is why is the 7 having such a difficult time nailing focus? Personally I wouldn't judge the lens from these shots alone and I would like to see some at f/2 so I could compare it to the X100 wide open - the Zeiss SHOULD be equal or sharper - if it isn't, then shame on Sony and Zeiss.

    On the other topic of DR, I see more DR in my 5N files than my X100 but that is at base settings (not with the X100 DR expansion engaged). I think the DR expansion setting on the X100 messes with the files too much so I don't use it. Steve Huff had some comparison shots of the X100 and NEX 7 with Zeiss and they looked to confirm what I see with the 5N.

    And on that note, I have a very nice X100 if anyone is looking to purchase one :)
     
  9. JJJPhoto

    JJJPhoto TalkEmount Regular

    116
    Aug 8, 2011
    First line, first paragraph of my previous post: Images NOT from the 7. I took those with the 3 and the Zeiss 24mm to get a feel for the way the 24mm renders.
     
  10. adanac

    adanac TalkEmount Regular

    51
    Sep 30, 2011
    Agree with you on the X100 DR - I've had mine turned off since I got the camera. The raw files work for me. I've been thinking that I wished the NEX-7 had the NEX-5N sensor, but maybe I want the X100's sensor. ;)

    Anyway, if the 5N (and 7) compete well enough with the X100 at base settings, I'll be happy.
     
  11. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Aug 6, 2011
    Thanks for sharing these samples! Do you have any samples from the 7 with this lens? I'm especially interested to look at some RAW files from that camera-lens combo if you have any to share.
     
  12. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    Thanks for sharing those pics! Since my last post was solely commenting on the NEX-7, I can't say I think the lens is worth 1000 ...

    To be fair, I have to say I never bought a lens for 1000 or more. But what I see here is a quality I would expect from the "cheap" 50mm lens, not from the 1000 Zeiss ... It's not even close to great sharpness, and although it renders colors quite well (hard to judge at this light conditions) the pictures just aren't stunning enough for a modern 1000€ lens.

    Compared to, let's say, the Voigtlander 35mm 1.4 I think the latter is much better, with a classier color rendering (if you like it), sharper in the center and smaller. No AF, but half the price. So, what to get? At least not the Zeiss.
     
  13. C Wadsworth

    C Wadsworth TalkEmount Regular

    33
    Aug 31, 2011
    Whoops, my bad. I saw it was the 3 in the EXIF and spaced it in my response. So do you think it was just "user error" or is there something else going on here?

    Even with the focusing errors and motion blur, I'm not seeing a particularly attractive Zeiss signature to this lens. Looking forward to getting it myself and comparing it to the 25mm C/Y Zeiss.
     
  14. C Wadsworth

    C Wadsworth TalkEmount Regular

    33
    Aug 31, 2011
    I wouldn't be too quick to judge on these samples. Focus is off and there is motion blur in the first pic. There are other samples out there that show much sharper results that are more consistent with what you would expect from this lens.
     
  15. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    Of course I'm going to look for more samples, and I'll read reviews on Photozone & co. I just say if this samples are anything to judge it by, it's not good enough. I hope it's better, just to have the option to get a great quality AF lens for my NEX. So, let's see. :)
     
  16. abrahavt

    abrahavt New to TalkEmount

    3
    Oct 26, 2011
  17. Phoenix

    Phoenix TalkEmount Top Veteran

    859
    Aug 25, 2011
    Melbourne, Australia
    Phoenix Gonzales
    Thanks for the interesting and helpful assessment dude, this sort of confirmed my commitment on purchasing the NEX 7, The reasons I was going to upgrade to the NEX 7 is because of the good EVF, the more intuitive interface, and the better dynamic range, if these things were included in the NEX 5 I wouldnt be upgrading at all. I'm not too intersted in the new Zeiss lens as I exclusively shoot with 3rd party or legacy lenses. I wouldnt be interested future NEX models even if Sony further revises their sensor and if they do develop and release a NEX 8 (or NEX 9?), even if they decide to go FF, I'm quite content with the sensor of the NEX 5, The only thing that may (and I repeat may) interest me in upgrading again after purchasing the NEX 7 is if they decide to include an in body stabiliser in future NEX models.
     
  18. C Wadsworth

    C Wadsworth TalkEmount Regular

    33
    Aug 31, 2011
    That's more like it! The "garlic" shot alone reaffirmed that this lens could be awesome. OOF rendering is attractive and the lens also looks very sharp edge to edge when stopped down.

    Thanks for the link! And those were shot on the 5N which will be my platform...