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Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera - This is what Sony really should have done!

Discussion in 'Sony Alpha E-Mount Cameras' started by Poki, Apr 9, 2013.

  1. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    NAB is clearly the show for Blackmagic Design. While their older 2,5k Cinema Camera had shipping problems, it was a great tool that delivered 2,5k RAW for €2,5k. Now they added their Production Camera, which shockingly (for Sony) offers 4k for €4k.

    But the best deal for us amateurs and hobbyists clearly is the Pocket Cinema Camera. It shoots 1920x1080 native as RAW video or Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) to an SD card. No expensive and big recording deck needed, and all that with an active MFT mount for 995 USD. Why, oh why can't Sony do something similar? Until now I thought I'd have been happy with clean HDMI out in a 7 replacement, but for the money a proper external recorder costs I could almost buy this camera ... So please, Sony, add proper pixel binning and a ProRes 24/25p codec! Oh, wait ... nobody would buy a VG30 then ... Oh! Add it there too, Sony! Is it really that hard?

    If you want to know more, head over to the beautiful website: Blackmagic Design: Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera

    What do you think about this camera? I, indeed, am tempted. But as E-Mount lenses can't be adapted - and I'm not going to invest in a second lens system - I won't buy it. Still, this got to be the greatest video capturing device of the year!
     
  2. bmg123

    bmg123 TalkEmount Veteran

    310
    Jan 15, 2013
    England, UK
    If this was proven to work well and had replaceable batteries (I don't think the original BlackMagic did) then I'd definitely like to get one. But at the same time I also love the photo quality of my 7, and it would really have to be an either/or situation due to the financial side. It's a real shame Sony aren't more up-to-date with this game; their image stabilisation and focus-peaking lend themselves perfectly to budding filmmakers yet they keep tossing poor-bitrate AVCHD our way. Prores in the 7 would be very welcome...
     
  3. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    Image stabilisation is not important to me (and many other filmmakers), but yep - focus peaking as well as the great chance to have a camera that's both one of the best photo cameras while still being a competent video camera would be great! But I'm afraid Sony won't give us a ProRes 422 codec - and if it's just to protect their own camcorder business ...
     
  4. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    This is a great kickass to the traditional manufacturers. Sony, Panasonic and Canon they'll be pulling his hair thinking about how to strikes back.

    The good thing is that this marks a way forward and the competition has to react, few people will now have reason to pay $3,000 for a DSLR does not incorporate RAW.
     
  5. demiro

    demiro TalkEmount Regular

    120
    Mar 2, 2012
    How does the Pocket Cinema Cam compare to the GH3?

    Does it have any application for an amateur just shooting family videos?
     
  6. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    Record in format RAW, format used until recently only available in professional digital pro and expensives cameras, the RAW capture content more information image do you see the camera sensor, when you see the RAW image you see a little color, but actually stores more information than you see, when you process information that allows you a wide range of things like shadows and rescue lights with less losses, in contrast to the DSLR cameras that automatically reveal the same camera and the information is processed and less information that is not such rescue like with RAW.

    That and the 13 EVF of Dynamic Range help much, because having more dynamic range gives you more information on both dark and light in a single image. In DSLR while when processing a video using contrast and depth to blacks lose some dynamic range steps -according I have read-.

    If we record a scene of a sunny day scenery with both chambers in the DSRL will have balanced foliage areas, but probably overexposed sky, while a camera like the Black Magic the RAW and dynamic range when processing it in editing, you have details on foliage and details in the sky.

    What worries me in the Black Magic is the factor 3x, because any lens superior to 17mm becomes a telephoto.

    Sorry for my english.
     
  7. davect01

    davect01 Super Moderator

    Aug 20, 2011
    Fountain Hills, AZ
    Dave
    It's nice, but no way am I gonna pay that much for a camera.

    As they say, competition is key to development.
     
  8. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    U$1,000 its cheap for what it offers.
     
  9. davect01

    davect01 Super Moderator

    Aug 20, 2011
    Fountain Hills, AZ
    Dave
    Not sure how it translates into US $. Just seeing 2.5k and 4K.

    Many of us bought into the NEX line to avoid the costs of the higher end systems. Not saying it is, or is not worth it to someone, just not many of us.
     
  10. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    Ok, the version 2.5K RAW costs U$3,995 and the 1080 RAW costs U$1,000

    The 4K format its an imposition of marketing, beyond 1080p the human eye dont perceives many things, but always the industry invents thins what we dont need and we go like sheep searching her.
     
  11. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    That's not true. First, the 2,5k RAW costs 2,500, not 3,995. Second, the human eye has no problems seeing more than 1080p. Either if its a 65 inch TV or a 27 inch computer screen, you'll need 4k everywhere. Whether 6k and 8k are important in the next few years, I doubt it, but 4k is the way to go for sure.

    That said, a 1080p RAW video camera for less than €1,000 is totally CHEAP! Oh, and you get ProRes too, for even easier, faster workflows and quality almost as good this is great!
     
  12. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    What price is my mistake U$3.995 costs the 4K version.

    On the human eye to read that the human eye 4K contained things that we perceived. Many projections we see in the movies are movies filmed in 1080.
     
  13. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    There aren't many movies shot in 1080p. Movies that were shot on film have the full film resolution (well, at least the resolution of super 35mm film), which easily is higher than 4k. And for digital movies - most professional cameras since 2005 shoot in 4k, and even before that some cameras with higher resolution than 1080p were available. If a movie was actually shot at 1080p, it probably can be upscaled to look quite good on a 4k screen.

    But this whole discussion completely misses the point of this thread. It's a fact that the eye sees much more than even 4k. But it's also a fact that this thread is about the BMD Pocket Cinema Camera, which shoots 1080p in (spec wise) awesome quality.
     
  14. davect01

    davect01 Super Moderator

    Aug 20, 2011
    Fountain Hills, AZ
    Dave
    Also, some of the same complaints can be made, that were made of the original 3 & 5.

    No viewfinder and no onboard flash. I know there were/are many photographers who refused to even look at the NEX line, just because if this.
     
  15. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    Onboard flash for a pure video camera? Not necessary, is it? ;)

    As for the viewfinder - again, this camera probably gets used on tripods, steadycams or in small camera rigs, no places where you could use a viewfinder. Of course there ARE people out there who like doing handheld video, but without any stabilization it may not be the best idea. And again, Blackmagic probably wanted to break the 1.000 price barrier at all cost, and with an EVF, that wouldn't have been possible.
     
  16. davect01

    davect01 Super Moderator

    Aug 20, 2011
    Fountain Hills, AZ
    Dave
    both

    It's being sold as both a video and stills device. Not saying it's a bad device, just some of the items that dismayed early NEX shoppers would still apply here.
     
  17. Manu-4Vendetta

    Manu-4Vendetta TalkEmount Regular

    133
    Apr 7, 2013
    Dominican Republic
    Emmanuel Peña
    But the Alexa only recently recorded in 4K and was used in film, or am I wrong?
     
  18. Poki

    Poki TalkEmount Hall of Famer

    Aug 30, 2011
    Austria
    No, it's not. It has a 2 MP sensor and no shutter button - only a video record button.


    That may be true (I don't follow Arri products except their master primes), but then again, it's one of many proffessional cameras.